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Thread: 2012 CC oil consumption

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    Junior Member TomM is just really nice TomM's Avatar
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    2012 CC oil consumption

    Do any of you guys have a problem with oil burning? I am having to add 3 quarts of synthetic between changes. An engineer with automotive experience is informing me that this is excessive consumption for a relatively new (2012) car.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Quote Originally Posted by TomM View Post
    Do any of you guys have a problem with oil burning? I am having to add 3 quarts of synthetic between changes. An engineer with automotive experience is informing me that this is excessive consumption for a relatively new (2012) car.
    You can take your car into the dealer and ask for an oil consumption test. However it seems pretty common for VWs turbo engines to consume oil. I don't recall what VW says is normal, I'm sure our resident tech will chime in.

    That said, if you are doing 10k changes with the proper oil (vw approved synthetic) it isn't unreasonable that you might have to add some oil during those 10,000 miles. The old adage of checking your oil levels when you get gas still applies.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    About 1 quart of oil consumed per 1000 miles is the maximum standard allowable usage. 3 quarts per 10,000 miles is quite acceptable...especially in warmer climates, city driving, fast highway driving, spirited driving, etc.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    But how the automotive engineer that I spoke with flatly states that this level of consumption is excessive for a relatively new vehicle and that it is evidence of either a design flaw or sloppy manufacturing. This guy has a degree from MIT. You think I should ignore his opinion?

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    I have already done that. My problem is that I don't trust VW to, in effect, grade its own examination papers. I am not at all certain that this "standard" will stand up before an unbiased arbitrator (not BBB) or judge. I have owned 22 new vehicles in my time including another car with a 2.0 turbocharged, direct injected engine with a 10,000 mile change interval and I have never experienced this level of consumption with any of the other vehicles. The idea of checking oil at every gas fill really does not work out even if you are willing to do it since you would have to let the car stand at the pump for around 15-30 minutes in order to get an accurate measure. My gut feeling is that a $30,0000 vehicle should not require this kind of wet nursing and certainly never would have been purchased by me had this consumption standard been disclosed before I bought. I feel that there is something very wrong here.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    I remember seeing the same complaint when I was researching A4's. If I'm not mistaken the CC shares the same engine? It seems to be hit or miss when people post reviews, which leads me (admitedly a mechanical novice at best) to think it is more likely to be a manufacturing flaw? I just bought a '13 CC and it's definitely something I'll keep an eye on.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Good luck with the CC. As I have already said, I think it is a great car in many ways and you should enjoy it. No one but a dope would believe that an engine would be intentionally designed to consume its own lubrication, particularly at the rate of $8 per quart. The oil goes where it does not belong which is into the combustion chamber. It can reach there in three ways: 1. Past the piston rings. 2. Past the valve guides in the head. 3. Though the PCV valve. MIT has done a study on the piston ring problem and determined (generally, not just VW) that leakage at this point could be a design defect with the ring being either too wide or too narrow. Sloppy manufacturing is another possibility.

    VW/Audi cannot satisfactorily explain this except to assert the ridiculous proposition that its TSI engine should normally use as much as 13.23 quarts of oil every 10,000 miles including the recommended 4.9 quarts at the end of this period. You can decide for yourself if you want to accept this. I think it violates the new car warranties.
    Last edited by TomM; 09-24-2012 at 07:55 AM. Reason: grammatical errors

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    I have an 06 jetta with the 2.0l turbo. I'm here because I'm looking to buy a 2010 cc with the same engine. I find it uses more oil than I'm used to. The VW mechanics I've talked to say that it is mostly going through the turbo to both cool and lubricate it. The MIT guy is probably talking about an engine that "burns" oil by going past the piston rings. That's what an old worn out engine will do. The mechanics have also told me that I can control how much oil it burns by how I drive the car. Fast starts, redline acceleration onto the highway both use the most oil. Drive nice and you will blow less oil though the turbo. I have 185,000 kms on my jetta and I have found this to be true by experimenting.

    Other cars I've owned that needed conventional oil changes every 5,000kms rarely needed oil between changes. With this turbo, and longer oil change intervals, and hard driving on my part means I have to add oil between changes.

    This is a highly engineered very high performance engine. To get that kind of power out of such a small engine you need to use more and different fluids. I was originally upset about the oil use, but man this thing is so much fun, I've never had an engine transmission combination that I have enjoyed as much as this engine and the DSG Transmission. I was going to go with a diesel on the next one but I've decided I want the fun, and economy be damned.

    I don't think they have a thread like this over at the Camry forum, maybe you should go have a look there.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    http://www.fordf150.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=69110
    http://partsblog.olathetoyota.com/49...l-consumption/
    http://repairpal.com/reasons-for-exc...onsumption-167
    http://www.automotiveforums.com/t698..._mazda_6_.html
    http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/foru...n-problem-fix/

    Quick google search for popular manufacturers and oil consumption problems. I googled oil consumption problems and vw wasn't even mentioned until the bottom of the second page. Everyone has oil consumption no matter what you buy. If every manufacturer states this is normal then I guess it's normal!
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Quote Originally Posted by nitroscope8 View Post
    http://www.fordf150.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=69110
    http://partsblog.olathetoyota.com/49...l-consumption/
    http://repairpal.com/reasons-for-exc...onsumption-167
    http://www.automotiveforums.com/t698..._mazda_6_.html
    http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/foru...n-problem-fix/

    Quick google search for popular manufacturers and oil consumption problems. I googled oil consumption problems and vw wasn't even mentioned until the bottom of the second page. Everyone has oil consumption no matter what you buy. If every manufacturer states this is normal then I guess it's normal!
    Really? My other cars (1984 SVO Mustang, 120K miles, and 1995 F150 Lightning (240kmiles) use no between changes! I haven't had my 2012 CC sport long enough to check but I would not expect to use oil at all. I will be changing oil/filter myself at 5k intervals

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    The MIT study considered all three sources of oil consumption which are oil passing by the valve guides, oil passing by the piston rings, and a failure of PVC system. Leaks are another matter. Turbocharged engines should burn no more oil than a naturally aspirated engine. Any oil consumption attributed to the turbocharger is a leak through the shaft bearing or seal. We all know that very small amounts of lubricant are consumed by a healthy engine but the manufacturers claims of a quart every 1,200 or so are grossly out of line and represent nothing more than an attempt to head off warranty claims based upon oil consumption. A new car burning measurable oil was ether a bad design (rare) or problems with manufacturing quality control. I believe the latter s the case with the VW 2.0 engine.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Quote Originally Posted by TomM View Post
    The MIT study considered all three sources of oil consumption which are oil passing by the valve guides, oil passing by the piston rings, and a failure of PVC system. Leaks are another matter. Turbocharged engines should burn no more oil than a naturally aspirated engine. Any oil consumption attributed to the turbocharger is a leak through the shaft bearing or seal. We all know that very small amounts of lubricant are consumed by a healthy engine but the manufacturers claims of a quart every 1,200 or so are grossly out of line and represent nothing more than an attempt to head off warranty claims based upon oil consumption. A new car burning measurable oil was ether a bad design (rare) or problems with manufacturing quality control. I believe the latter s the case with the VW 2.0 engine.
    Since you will be footing the bill because Volkswagen is technically not liable for your level of usage, what will you be replacing first? Three tenths of a milliliter usage per mile is not a lot.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Who says VW is not liable for this excessive oil consumption? VW? This is definitely a warranty issue and if pressed, they will pay but not because they want to.

    According to the MIT study, a properly designed and manufactured new engine with or without a turbocharger does not consume measurable amounts of oil and certainly would not require 3 quarts between changers.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    YOU are the one claiming excessive use. Specification for oil consumption is higher than your usage so YOU state it's excessive and NOT them. In court you will be humiliated and walk away broke. If anything they will give you a 1000 bux toward a new VW because they feel bad that you are spending thousands on a lawyer that can't help you. I'm sure an MIT study will force Volkswagen to come to their senses and buy you a new engine.

    Would you like oil? If you can't afford oil i'll gladly ship you a case so you don't have to worry about paying for it.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    I had my suspicions about you but now I know that you are a VW shill. For those with a serious interest in the facts, the "spec" is not published by VW along with the other specifications so this "spec" is a phony and nothing more than an attempt to discourage warranty claims. I should also tell you that I have been this route before against another car manufacturer so I know that it will work. VW has no effective defense to a breach of warranty claim but they do hire good lawyers and will put up a fight TO A POINT. Once they understand that you do have a case, it will not be allowed to reach a trial; they will setttle. The settlement will be a buyback of the car, not a new engine, and the price is based upon a formula that is in the state statutes.

    What VW/Audi is doing here is wrong. Because not all FSI engines do burn oil, the problem is not likely to be a design problem but more likely a manufacturing problem. The engine is assembled in a factory in Hungary which is the probable source of the defect: Poor quality control.

    You make light of the problem but fail to note that oil burning is more than just the cost of the burned oil. Since the engine is not designed to burn its lubrication as a fuel, over time other parts of the engine will be damaged with resultant decline in performance. This will be more of a cost than the case of oil you so sarcastically offer.

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Correct! Not only am I an enthusiast but I also get paid to fix these things. More that breaks the better for my personal gain. When on the books and at work I AM an adjuster for the company. Utilizing my warranty administrator and all other resources we determine what is considered defective and what is not, and if we will be paid by Volkswagen. If VW won't pay, neither will I out of my own pocket for a repair deemed unnecessary. If the customer at this point doesn't agree with what VW thinks then a lawsuit will soon follow.

    This is where you are at now. Please report back with the results of your pursuit of happiness with the company. I'm curious to see how this pans out and what, if any, compensation is offered.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Assuming that you are what you say you are, now you are at least honest. I can tell you right now how this will play out because I have done it before. VW was given the required notice of the defect within the 2 yr/24000 window. As soon as I have used all of my paid maintenance, I will attempt to trade this car for another car (not a VW/Audi) that is comparable. If I get a fair price after factoring out all of the fat, kickbacks, etc., the matter will end there. If I don’t get a fair price (J.D. Power is aware of these problems), then I will sue VW for breach of warranty and fraud under the local equivalent of the Magnuson-Moss Act. The fraud claim is based upon VW’s concealment of its consumption standard until after purchase. Calling it a “spec” under these circumstances is not a defense for VW since the issue is non-disclosure. In my case, I will have no duty to first arbitrate the claim because the VW arbitration program is not certified. Once suit is started, VW (they have good lawyers) will play hardball until they discover the quality of the expert testimony I have available. At that point, VW will settle the case to avoid a court ordered buy-back by buying the car back for the amount required by statute. VW will also pay all costs of litigation including my attorney’s fees and the expert witness fees because that is what the law provides and I will not accept less. This will save VW from the possible punitive damage award plus it will prevent this oil issue from becoming recorded public information which at present it is not.

  19. #18
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    Good luck to you. I do agree that the oil consumption seems a bit extreme. Though it seems (for VW) to be limited to turbo'd engines. It's hard to say how the vehicles have been taken care of, if proper oil changes and maintenance have been performed. Not saying you haven't done so, but there are always two sides to a story.

    Also, I'll vouch for Nitroscope8, not that it means anything to you, but he is what he says he is and, if I remember, one of the top 20 VW technicians in the US.
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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    OK... here is my experience. I have two VW, a CC and a Tiguan. Both cars with the same type of engine Code CZB... In one of them I have ZERO oil consumption but in the other I have to top up between service.

    I am tired to hear that the turbo charged cars has to have "some" oil consumption. That it is not true.
    Both cars are used in the same conditiones ( weather, driver style, etc) so you can imagine the face of the dealership when I ask him why is that difference between these cars....

    We all know the real issue here, is called quality control. So if anyone of you has this problem keep pushing they need to fix this...


    I really do not want to discuss, I just want to share my experiences and of course I will never buy again a VW/Audi.

    By the way both are the TSI engine, it is well known the problem with the FSI engine. They supposed to fix them but it is look like they did not....

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    Re: 2012 CC oil consumption

    You are 100% correct. According to the mechanical engineer I consulted, this is a quality control issue. The car in general seems be fairly well made but the engine is not. It made in Hungary. Down the road, the residue from this oil consumption will be found somewhere and most likely around the valves. At that point, the performance of this engine will deteriorate. VW will do nothing for the owner unless forced. They hope any claim will go to arbitration where they have a chance to resolve it without high cost of great publicity but their arbitration program feels to meet required standards of many states and is not, therefore, certified or mandatory. This brings you to a law suit. The suit is very winable but no suit is fun even if you win and a good lawyer is required. The best bet for the average guy is to avoid VW products, particularly this TSI engine, until they clean up their act. In my case, as I have said, I plant to trade this car as soon as the prepaid maintenance is used up and if I get a fair price on a non VW/Audi car, I will take it and consider myself fortunate. If I don't get a fair price, I will take VW straight to court and in addition to claiming breach of warranty on the oil defect, I will also claim special damages for their failure to disclose this "spec" until after the sale of their car is completed.

    Good luck to you.

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