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Thread: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    Took a road trip a few days ago and on the way back home I noticed that during very particular and narrow rpm range there was what from inside the car sounded like an exhaust leak. I forgot about it once I got home, drove it to work last night and again through the exact same very narrow rpm range came that sound. Pulled over, opened hood, heard a chirping sound when I brought the motor up to that rpm... So today after a long nap I went at it. usual things checked, belts... Nope, although they should be replaced which is good to know now, neither of them made a sound. The sound after crawling under the car appeared to come from behind the motor possibly exhaust. Checked for leaks to the best of my abilities till things got too hot, nothing notable. Noticed the noise happens at opperating temp. As I pulled myself out from underneath I put pressure on the bracket that bolts to the down pipe off the manifold and to the engine block right above the oil pan, noise stopped. Let go, noise returned... Pushed up on it again noise stopped... Click image for larger version

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ID:	10920 Here is the bracket im talking about at the bottom of the pic. So to my logic I figured maybe a loose bolt. Went through checked all the bolts on the exaust, manifold, engine mount (basicaly anything that connected with in 2 bolts to this bracket) Tightened anything that seemed loose by 1/16 of a turn. Started the car again, back to op temps... again with the chirp... Next step was take a tube of vacume line I had left over, stuck it in my ear and started listening. The noise is at its loudest on the down pipe where it connects to the flex pipe. Cant hear the noise at all under the valve cover, only very faintly in the intake manifold if at all. The first thing that comes to mind when hearing this sound is metal rubbing together under vibration but Ill be damned if I can figure it out. Im not sure if the rest of this info means anything but Im always paranoid its a head gasket or a ring so... To the best of my knowledge there is maybe 1/4 of a quart of oil less since the last change (~800 miles ago). And with the last fuel stop was at 45mpg as opposed to the usual 47mpg. On my road trip there were slight engine temp fluctuations under load while going up hill (hotter) but no over heat and the temp went back low once the pressure was off, its a 1.5 diesel so hills turn this thing into the little engine that could. Idles ok. The coolant is dark (blackish) but not "oily" and smells noteably like coolant although ive never seen coolant this color before. No bubbles, froth, milky/coffeeish fluid in either coolant or oil. Oil is black. There is no noticeable leaks on the block, head or valve cover. None of the pulleys made any unusual noises and had no scores or marks to indicate anything unusual. Oil definately flows to the cams (found that out the hard way, wanted to get a better listen with the valve cover off, I definately understand why this thing has a splash guard in there...) there was some smoke under the valve cover which I assume is normal.

    Now my usual approach is to start taking things appart until I find the problem. Honestly though that in the past has cost me more money than what its needed to replacing parts that didnt need replacing only to find that the problem was something very simple. Plus with this old motor I dont want to risk stripping any bolts or breaking one unless all other options have been exhausted. I also assume that if it was something internal the noise would be constant and in direct proportion to rpm instead of only happening at a specific rpm but I could be mistaken. I have never experienced a noise like this before that wasnt from a belt or a water pump so I am at a complete loss and am about to pull things appart from the valve cover down. I am hoping that someone else may have experienced this before or may have some insight to suggest something I havent thought of yet.

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    Super Moderator briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    If it is a vibration, then suspect the motor mounts if you see that your rear view mirror is vibrating.
    You have the older sirrocco dual down pipe, which had that engine mount to the pipe. Well to be honest that mount was done away with on the later Cabriolet dual down pipe, If you buy a new dual down, which you don't need, they come without the mount from TT-Tuning, and most headers that you can buy after market don't have that either.

    So I would just remove that bracket, and say be gone squeak.

    I have found that over the years that bad motor mounts cause a variety engine speed related of noises.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    CarlosA (08-28-2012), kraut83 (09-06-2012)

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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    That probably explains some of the sounds/vibrations I get at various speeds too.

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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    Thats reassuring. Ill remove it tomorrow and see how it goes. That brace seemed pointless to me anyway. Thanks brian

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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    Thought to update briefly. Sorry its taken so long ive been with out internet for a week. I took that bracket off, in the process there was a clink and I recieved 2 pieces for the price of one. Chirp solved. Thanks again! Bad news, the front pipe apperantly was also cracked because that broke off while driving yesterday, glad I was close to home and I live in the middle of no where and didnt wake anybody up with the ROAR haha.

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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    I asked this question in another post aswell but I figure if it doesnt get hit there it will get answered here. I ordered new motor mounts since they werent too expensive and since they shipped with the front pipe was even cheaper on shipping. Can the motor mounts be replaced one at a time with the engine in the car? I dont have my bently book yet and my thought was put car on ramps, use a jack on engine, lift up engine on one side, replace mount, rinse repeat on the other 2. Can this be done with out damaging anything or am I just being foolishly hopefull that I dont need more tools?

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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    Yes they can, however, to remove the mounts from the car on the passenger side is a real PITA. To replace them in the mount you are going to need a press....or have them pressed in.

    You can use the Fire and water method in a pinch as I have done in the past, but since I got my 6 ton bench press it is a piece of cake.

    http://www.vintagewatercooleds.com/t...engine-mounts/


    The way I just did it 2 weeks ago.
    http://www.toplessrabbit.com/forums/...p=25458#p25458
    Last edited by briano1234; 09-07-2012 at 11:28 AM.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    ROFL! I love the way you did it recently. Sounds like my way of doing things, like using a 2x6 and another car to break the seel on a tire and rim... Anyhow I have a forge and anvil with a large hammer. Im hoping mine will be as "easy" as that. I have to admit Im looking forward to this, ive never replaced engine mounts before and Im glad its on this motor, it certainly looks less complicated than any other car Ive ever owned. Ill work on it next week assuming the parts are here and Ill let you know how it went. Thanks again Brian!

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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    quick update. All my parts arrived and ive started on the mounts. The only one I've managed to get off so far due to time constraints is the driver side mount only to find out that I recieved 2 passenger side mounts... a phone call later and the correct part is hopefully on its way. They told me I could keep the extra motor mount. About how long do the mounts last under regular driving conditions? should I keep the mount or offer it to somebody else at a bit of a discount?

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    Super Moderator briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    Quote Originally Posted by kraut83 View Post
    quick update. All my parts arrived and ive started on the mounts. The only one I've managed to get off so far due to time constraints is the driver side mount only to find out that I recieved 2 passenger side mounts... a phone call later and the correct part is hopefully on its way. They told me I could keep the extra motor mount. About how long do the mounts last under regular driving conditions? should I keep the mount or offer it to somebody else at a bit of a discount?
    20-40K less with a stiffer/lower car.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Junior Member kraut83 is just really nice kraut83's Avatar
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    Re: Strange Chirping noise, no usual culprits

    So Ive replaced all the motor mounts, new timing belt and tensioner (properly tensioned), adjusted IP, and am in the process of putting in the resonator from replacing the 2 into 1 pipe that broke. So far everything has gone very smooth. Unfortunatly waiting for parts to arrive and other priorities its taking longer than expected but by tuesday it should be back on the road. I turned the motor over 3 times by hand to make sure there are no binds and the IP is set at .86 which is the mid point for the bentley range. Ill post how it runs when its finaly all back together.

    Out of curiosity Ive tried to look up what having the timing advanced and retarded would mean and Ive had a hard time understanding it. If I wanted better fuel mileage I want it advanced correct? but advancing it would lower the top end meaning less power in the upper gears? and Im assuming advancing the timing means that if the range is .82mm to .92mm advanced with in range would be .92? Does retarding it then lower fuel mileage and increase overall power (torque or hp)? and this is strictly for the IP timing, Id prefer not to mess with the mechanical timing due to not wanting to risk critical mechanical failures.

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