I was driving home from working last week in my 3.5 month old Tiguan when suddenly the ECP light and the Check Engine Light came on. At the same time the Cruise Control symbol popped up on the display monitor. The RPMs fell so low that I thought it was going to go dead.
Anyone out there have a similar problem?
Last edited by PJnVA; 08-13-2010 at 12:10 PM.
What octane do you use?
I don't use the high octane, but I don't remember what the number is. 87? I've been using it since the day I bought it and from what I've read about octane levels, it only makes a difference in performance not whether or not the car runs.
This is where european RON numbers begin to cause mass confusion.
Premium is recommended. The 2.0T can run on lower octane gas with reduced performance. However in the US we use (R+M)/2 which is RON + MON / 2 (Research Octane Number + Motor Octane Number divided by 2) In Europe they only use RON. The difference equates to several octane points.
This is further proven by reseach done on a 2010 Jetta in a recent issue of European Car. When adding US premium fuel the ECU compensated and reported better number than those produced by the recommended "regular" fuel.
This probably doesn't answer any of your questions, but before you decide you have a lemon run a couple of tanks of premium and see if the issue comes back or is resolved.
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My gti uses the same engine as your tiguan, my gas door says min 91 octane.
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Yes, the owner's manual does say that and using lower octane gas doesn't explain why all those things happened to my car. It's just an excuse because the service dept. can't fine anything else.
Running a 2.0T using lower than the recommended octane could lead to all of the problems you're having. Lets say on Wednesday you topped off with the (insert generic gas station name here) special. Due to low quality controls the 87 octane you pumped contains more impurities than a top tier fuel companies (Chevron Supreme for instance). This triggers the knock sensor which forces the car into limp mode. Resulting in reduced power to prevent damage to the engine.
Now this should have triggered a CEL, which you claim it did. If so they should have a log file on your vehicle. I would go back and consult the head of the service department.
i just took a picture of mine but my email is being stupid right now...this is the same exact label i have.
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Any guesses why the cruise control display came on at the exact same time as the other two lights?
EPC, CEL and cruise are symtoms of limp mode...when the cruise is lit its deactivated to prevent damage.
At least im 90% sure of that, moose'll be here around 5pm est.
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I also forgot to mention that I'd been driving on this tank of gas for 1.5 weeks with no issues. And I buy gas from the same 2 gas stations most of the time (one near home and one near work).
I use Sunoco which is convenient. I don't really know anything about suppliers except that I dont buy Exxon - but that's a who other post (LOL).
The service dept said the car's sensor showed that I what I said happened as I described. They just can't find a reason for it. They been in touch with VW and did all their recommended tests, including driving it for 2 days with the computer hooked up to it.
What faults did the computer show? If those lights came on then it triggered a fault and it WILL be recorded, no question about that. The epc light will come on when a powertrain sensor malfunction occured. This can be knock sensor, throttle body, or air mass meter.
I can remember in particular and Eos with the same engine you have in the Tiggy that came in for a check engine light and similar symptoms. I checked the faults and it had a knock sensor malfunction. I tested the sensors and it came back fine. I went for a test drive and the engine was seeing knock and it was retarding the ignition timing by 12 degrees. The knocking cannot be felt but the sensors pick it up. When the engine control module sees a timing pull of 6-12 degrees or more then it triggers a malfunction. There are several causes for this: Major internal engine damage (would be audible) low engine oil pressure (warning light would be on) or low octane fuel being used.
When I questioned the owner of this Eos he said 87 octane fuel was being used since he bought it several th ousand miles prior.
I explained to him that you need to use premium but in a pinch y ou can use regular fuel and have significantly less power for a tank or so. If you use regular all the time then you will have problems. This applies to you as well. Start by using 91 or 93 (I highly suggest 93) for every fillup.
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This post does not reflect the views or opinions of Volkswagen AG or any individually owned dealer or entity.
This post is simply my personal, not professional, opinion.
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Thank you. My service dept has said they've done all they can do so I will pick it up today. They never discussed with me the type of fuel I'm using. They just keep insisting there was water in the gas. I will try using the higher octane fuel and hope for the best. I appreciate all the responses.
I posted in a different thread that I started. I have a 2010 Wolfsburg. This is NOT an octane rating problem. Mine just started doing this after the 30K maint and up until that, absolutely perfect, best freaking car I've ever owned. Again...sorry, this is not a simple octane issue and for anyone who thinks or claims so, I call BS. The end result may infact come down to something simple but I am taking my car in Friday, for the 3rd time. And no, I'm not happy about it. The only pattern I have is that it gets worse AFTER I fill the tank up. I've done the gas cap check, 3 times every time I fill up, I make sure it is secure and clicks. It is simply weird. I have no logical explanation for it. 2 weeks ago, I took it back to the dealer and quoting the tech, "tons of error codes," couldn't find anything wrong but pointed to the ignition coils. He did find that every one of them was not seated at the proper height so he corrected that and no problems for 4 days then it returned, again after I filled up the next tank of gas. If THAT was the problem, why didn't it do that during the first 30K miles? I've tried several different gas stations, no patterns noted. I get EPC, check engine and sluggish or no acceleration. Have to pull over if it occurs while I'm driving, stop car and restart, sometimes, 9-10+ times while waiting a minute or two between. Or, this occurs when I get back in my car after it's been sitting for a few hours or over night and it won't start without the EPC check engine lights. I've never had the cruise control light issue. My opinion again is that it's not that simple as an octane thing because why would it just start doing this out of the blue after 30K miles? On another forum, I read about a guy who it started doing it to him after only 36 miles and just a few days of owning the vehicle. I foresee a technical bulletin and an eventual recall when someone finally gets to the bottom of this which would be quite nice so I can go back to raving about the best damn car I've ever bought. That is way more fun than putting up with this.
This is an update I posted in another thread with the same issue:Update: Houston, we found the problem! Took my car in at 8:30 am today and they called me by 1:00 with the answer. I'll just type what's on the repair order:
"35938 Chafed wire road tested, GFF, PO53F, PO651. Checked out ran all tests adn tested ok. Called hotline and recommended me to pull intake manifold. Removed engine cover and turbo boost pressure hose. Removed throttlebody and oil filter, removed manifold and inspected. Started unplugging connectors and moving harness to inspect for chafing. Finally found section where it wore through at oil cooler. Repaired section and returned engine to running operation. Reset settings and road tested after repairs."
So, it was a wire that was shorting out and not mysteriously an octane issue. I will update in a week or sooner if the symptoms return. Hopefully this is the end of this and I can return to enjoying the best car I've ever owned!