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Thread: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Progress - oil senders/switches changed and wired...
    Old 1.8 Bar Switch

    New .3 Bar Switch/0-5 Bar Pressure Sender

    Old .3 Bar Switch

    New 1.8 Bar Switch


    Next - dash wiring corresponding with the new switches!

    Cheers,

    Eric
    Last edited by BluGTI; 03-19-2017 at 10:47 PM. Reason: pic link update

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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hey All,
    One potential casualty of the 1.8 Bar switch installation - while loosening the switch bumped into the distributor and it rotated like 1/8th turn to counter clockwise. I turned it back but no way to tell if it is in the same place.

    Assuming that it should have been torqued down so it could not turn. Hoping that it is close enough to start and run! Assuming I'd need a timing light to reset? But then of course my motor is tweaked so not sure where it should be set.
    Take it to a shop? E.

  4. #63
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Quote Originally Posted by BluGTI View Post
    Hey All,
    One potential casualty of the 1.8 Bar switch installation - while loosening the switch bumped into the distributor and it rotated like 1/8th turn to counter clockwise. I turned it back but no way to tell if it is in the same place.

    Assuming that it should have been torqued down so it could not turn. Hoping that it is close enough to start and run! Assuming I'd need a timing light to reset? But then of course my motor is tweaked so not sure where it should be set.
    Take it to a shop? E.
    One way and the only way to tell is to set it in time statically. That is the Crank finger to 0tdc, the dimple on the back of the cam to be even with the heads valve cover tin, not re-bar, and the Dizzy is in the middle of the has that is stamped on the frame of the Dizzy. www.cabby-info.com has pictures.

    I would suspect that you will be in the Ball Park...... On the Early CIS, you have to set it with a timing light.
    Once you know it is in the ball park, then you can start the car and move it a tad either way......
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hey All,

    Well began soldering in the final connections on the instrument cluster plug...and realized that I had never traced the (now .3 Bar) blue wire, from the can, back to the dash as I could not get a ring/continuity with any of the wires in the the instrument bundle previously. So back to forensic wire tracing tomorrow...
    Stay tuned... E.

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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hello Briano and Gang,

    Progress...

    Found a stray wire under the dash that rings with the .3 Bar switch on the can. The wire coming off the can is Blue. However the wire under the dash is connected to a Blue/Black wire that appears to come out of the back of the fuse box (not sure where the other half of that wire is...) I can only guess that they had this running to the Oil Pressure gauge since it had a female blade connector on it. In any case it looks like I now have my .3 Bar switch wire for the instrument cluster.

    Tried testing the Brake Pressure switch from the proportioning valve (again) as we discussed earlier - it still goes to ground somewhere after the plug next to the fire wall and disappears into the harness after that where it cannot be followed. While it sounded like an advantage to just leave it as is - in hopes that this "grounding" is normal - and so that they Brake light would be in the bulb test loop, the down side would seem to be that if it is not supposed to go to ground after that plug (e.g. it was shorted when the dash was hacked up) I will have a problem when I put it all back together.

    So I am thinking, again, about cutting it off at the plug and running the wire directly to the dash Brake light (along with the parking brake).

    Oh master of the all things VW electrical - if it were you what path would you choose?

    Many Thanks, E.

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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    And damn if I didn't remember this right as I was in bed and the computer shut down...this is becoming an obsession....

    The Blue wire from the 3. Bar sender (as I remember and mentioned eons ago in this thread) is spliced into a Blue/Black wire in the harness under the hood near the trans. So it appears they found that wire in the fuse box and cut into it to complete the circuit. How the hell they ever found that wire in the morass of wires on the back of the fuse box is beyond me!

    However this is a different Blue/Black wire than the one that comes in to the gauge cluster from the (now) 1.8 Bar switch on the oil flange?! Go figure. E.

    P.S. I'm leaning toward cutting and rerouting the Brake Pressure switch wire rather than taking a chance it does not work in the current (grounded path). Agree?

  8. #67
    Super Moderator briano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234's Avatar
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Whilst I concur, on your assessment I can concur that sometimes it is better to run new, than try to find the old. (quicker actually).
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Progress,

    It is sooo much easier to just roll the car out of the tiny cramped little one car garage into the sunlight and open spaces of the driveway!

    To date since we began this quest...redone/rewired/connected are...
    - Headlight Switch
    - Brake Warning Light
    - Instrument Panel
    - Rear Defrost
    - Emergency flashers
    - Gauges (with addition of oil pressure sender)

    Remaining dash-wise...
    - Lighter Plug/lights
    - Radio (clean it up, replace rear speaker wires) Since the fender antenna was shaved, and the "bee sting" antenna on the roof seems not to have any wires coming from it to under the dash (and cannot see if it even has a wire with the headliner in) I have to relocate the antenna they had foam taped to the inside air intake since the heater was gone. Probably would work better on the under side of the dash anyway.

    Then it is on to the big leagues - working on getting the heater box and connections back in!

    Thanks for the support here Briano! Making progress it feels like!

    While these may not look like much - they represent a ton of progress vs. the "explosion in a wire factory" my dash was at the start!





    Best Regards,

    Eric

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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Cool knew that you could do it....
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Back To Work!

    So I've cataloged all the remaining wires/plugs and am in the process of identifying them...stay tuned...

    In the mean time I was hoping that someone here could identify the approximate year of the heater box that I removed from a dead Cabby last summer - and which I will be putting into my 84 GTI - in place of the one the previous owner yanked out.

    So here are some pics! Thanks All, E.








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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    looks early, the controls are all there, I have a couple of how do I do that's on the control to make it more better.
    Did you get all the heater vents and tubing, as well as the double grommets for the Water and a/c lines?
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hey Briano,

    Thanks! Yes, the double grommet is still in my firewall for the heater core (all the better to let bugs and critters in!) and the previous owner gave me a set of AC lines that have the big conical rubber grommets on them ( I'll install the AC lines now too since I have the dash apart - but wait on the rest of the under-hood AC parts until next year). Hoping that those AC lines are universal and not Cabby/Westy specific - not sure what ones I have.

    And I yanked the heater tubes from the same car (as well as another just in case). And I believe I have the center vent as well (where they had parked the radio previously). And got the wide piece of rubber that seals the heater box to the vent. Knowing to grab the other parts was thanks to your AC conversion threads!

    Guessing I will need a new resistor (or do I/can I just clean up the rust?) and definitely a new fan motor. Approximately what year am I looking for when you say "early" so that I know what I am looking for?

    I'll probably start disassembling the box tonight. I can see a rusty "ring" around the inside of the box so it must have been holding water so not sure about the heater core or condenser at this point - but if they look serviceable I will try to find a radiator shop to pressure check them before reassembling the box. Luckily I have managed (so far) not to kink that skinny little copper line.

    Please let me know where to find your tips on the heater controls.

    Thanks Again, E.

  14. #73
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?


    Thanks! Yes, the double grommet is still in my firewall for the heater core (all the better to let bugs and critters in!) and the previous owner gave me a set of AC lines that have the big conical rubber grommets on them ( I'll install the AC lines now too since I have the dash apart - but wait on the rest of the under-hood AC parts until next year). Hoping that those AC lines are universal and not Cabby/Westy specific - not sure what ones I have.


    Sanden equipped yes, but York equipped possibly, I don't know for a fact. (compressor)

    And I yanked the heater tubes from the same car (as well as another just in case). And I believe I have the center vent as well (where they had parked the radio previously). And got the wide piece of rubber that seals the heater box to the vent. Knowing to grab the other parts was thanks to your AC conversion threads!


    Use a new heater core, and hoses one less issue that you want to readdress later.

    Guessing I will need a new resistor (or do I/can I just clean up the rust?) and definitely a new fan motor. Approximately what year am I looking for when you say "early" so that I know what I am looking for?

    In my experience on the Diesel Rabbit and Cabbies I have owned the Resistor is Welded to the wires of the motor, not easily replaced, and ones that I have seen are for a 3 speed motor not a 4 speed. (a/c by factory has 4 speed fan)

    I'll probably start disassembling the box tonight. I can see a rusty "ring" around the inside of the box so it must have been holding water so not sure about the heater core or condenser at this point - but if they look serviceable I will try to find a radiator shop to pressure check them before reassembling the box. Luckily I have managed (so far) not to kink that skinny little copper line.

    Well that is for the Expansion Valve, and you can buy those new (universal fit) (the thin kinky).
    They hold water because before 1983 the a/c boxes didn't have a screen over the fresh air intake, so the box would plug up with debris.... This would fill the box and not drain out.

    The Fresh air inbox with screened improvement.


    IIRC My rabbit diesel had the opening off to the side and debris you hit the vents on the hood, bounce down the rain divertor, and be sucked right in to the Fresh air box, take a ride around the fan, through the heater core or the expansion and deposit itself at the bottom of the heater box, to try to flush away down the drain, but depending on the size it would usually plug it.

    I didn't find this out till my passenger side floor flooded because there was so much run off of the box, it filled the floorboard when it Thawed from sitting in 90 degree temps....

    Please let me know where to find your tips on the heater controls.

    The older rabbit thread the DIY list, contains a list of my how-to's by category.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Rotten to the "Core" Heater Box,

    Lovely, just lovely. So that $50 junk yard heater box isn't looking quite as good as it did...

    Do the heater hoses come with the bend in them - or did they just become that way over time? (e.g. VW specific parts or auto store bulk hose?)
    Any recommendations for a good place to source the fan motor, heater core and evaporator? (I tend to bounce between a number of sites not knowing if one is better!) Is there a year range I should be shooting for when I talk to the parts place? While I think the motor may still have a part number the core and condenser probably are covered in rust!

    I'll see if I can yank the compressor I have out of one of the 3 18-gallon totes of spare parts that came with frankenbunny and check out the brand. And I remember seeing the screen you added to the fresh air inlet - good idea after seeing all the debris in the heater box. I do have the rubber drain hose on the tunnel in the car - and you can see marks where the grommets once were for the AC lines in place at one time - so I believe it originally had AC.

    Sounds like it is not a great idea to try to replace the resistor if serviceable. So I've also included some close up shots of the resistor that came with the heater box (rustier contacts but solid wires running to the motor) vs. a spare I scavenged which has less rust but one of the motor wires is shredded (critter perhaps) and it has a small chip in the ceramic/paint coating over the coils. Thinking of perhaps using a dremel with a fine wire brush and gentle touch to clean the terminals of rust and then painting them with some of that high temp ceramic grill touch up paint to prevent future rust. Crazy?

    On the plus side the rubber gasket that seals the halved of the box together seems somewhat soft still. Don't know if the water evaporated or leaked past it at some point. Do I reuse or try to find a new one?

    Here is a shot of the inside...



    "Current" Resistor...




    Spare resistor with motor wire case gone on one side and chip in wrapping cover. Seems kind of like the original may be best since it has both the motor wires intact and ready to splice in the new motor?



    Thanks Briano!! E.

  16. #75
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    The heater hoses should have a 90 degree bend on one end, they are both the same, only you have to cut one for the heater valve.
    they aren't that expensive.

    Put the motor on a bench and hold it down good, let the fan spin free..... try putting a ground and a +12 on it to see if it spins... if it does cabby-info.com has a how to take apart the motor and recondition it..

    The Evaporator core may be good, but you can find a new one for about 150 you might call a radiator repair shop to see if they can boil it clean and pressure test it.. in the oldie days I think it cost me about 15 bucks... but that was in the early 70's, the same fans can be found, but they are 252 usually.... I think I paid 175 for mine about 10 years ago... My fault I dropped it and broke the fan blades.
    Heater cores aren't that much, I think the last one I bought was 50...

    Cleaning the rust won't kill it, and isn't crazy. The wires should be spot welded to the resistor, and the resistor gets H-O-T-A-A-P.
    I would probably spray wd-40 on the rear carrier bearing of the motor, and if you can get a squirt on the front. But if the fan spins freely... you may have a working motor. They get rusty because they are exposed to moist air.... common to a point.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Thanks Briano!

    The blower motor was upstream in the flow of the water that filled the heater box - however it still turns by hand with a bit of resistance, however one or the springs that holds the brush against the commutator so no way to test it. I'll take a look at the rebuild instructions you referenced and see if it can be saved. I can look for the spring at the hardware store. Looking online there are tons of heater cores and evaporators - but no blower motors. So hope this one will come back!

    Oddly enough the heater core hoses are close to straight as the heater core fittings exit at 90 degrees. They have a slight angle in them but after I pulled them out they look like they could have been straight originally.

    Getting what looks like the temperature probe out of the evaporator was tough - ended up having to go in between the fins and give it a bit of a push. I may have nicked the end of it - but then again it might have just been the way it was sealed up. Do you know if the tube is filled with anything? Vacuum? I'm thinking I just try to get some solder on the end of it otherwise just to be safe. Any idea how it works? (otherwise managed to get it off without any kinks in the line at least).

    Thanks again! E.

  18. #77
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    The Blower motors are listed at napa, they are @ 250.
    There were 2 styles of cores one for a/c and one for no ac.

    I think you could get by using straight hose, as the core itself has a sort of 90 of the hoses coming off the core.

    There were 2 probes on the evap. One for the expansion valve exterior to the box


    And one for the Thermoswitch that is in the dash.


    On the earlier VW's Diesel I owned the Thermoswitch was on the side of the heater box, and not in the controls.

    Both IIRC have a Squeezed end. I do think they are vacuumed controllers but don't know for sure.
    The Thermoswitch usually is in a Brass tube that is connected to the Evap core. at least on my Cabriolets. I have had to replace it and the tube came out with the probe end.

    Now whilest you are re-wiring...
    You might think about installing a a/c cut out switch... I have a how to on it. But basically you take the wires of the Selector switch on the control unit (two red capped wires) on the right side of the controller One is below and one in the middle, and unspool them. Take them to a switch Lighted or not, and Presto, you have a/c any time you want, and not when the sliders are in a certain position.... So I can have Defroster only no/ac, or fresh air in no/ac or recycle the inside air (max ac) with no a/c.

    I know that the Germans engineered this a little funky, but hey, the Japanese, and Mericans had a a/c cut out why can't I.

    The thermoswitch when you move the slider to a/c monitors the Evap core. Once it starts to Ice up the evap core, it will turn on (n/o switch) and cause the a/c compressor to kick off, so it can defrost... (you know that lug when the a/c cuts in and out?).... I have but on one occasion found that my a/c would do this on longer runs....as in hours down the highway.
    The short hops it didn't......

    I have also been thinking that the next time my a/c screwed the pooch, that I would look into a "Honda" or Nissan Compressor, sure I would need hoses made,,,, but their compressors are half the size and weight of ours.

    Factoid. My 81 Diesel was the first rotary compressor on a car I or my Father and Brothers had ever seen.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


  19. #78
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hey Briano,
    Thanks, I see the blower motor at Napa - local store can get it for me at $269 + $15 shipping from Canada! But my motor is pretty well cashed. Managed to get it open and the bushing off that was seized. I may still try to get the old one functional again but with these things as uncommon as they seem to be I think I'll spring for anew one new while I can find one!

    Thanks for the pics. First rotary compressor? Ya think they would have figured out the heater controls a bit better!

    I like the idea about the AC switch - I'll revisit it when I get closer to the re-installation. A smaller lighter compressor sounds like a good idea as well.

    So what about that gasket in between the halves of the heater box? Find a new one? use a bead of silicone when I put it together? use the old gasket and silicone? Reuse the original? Heard you about a leaking box - and after all this don't want to risk it. Thougths?

    Plan for the weekend - if warm (and I can roll her outside) run the rear speaker wires and if not figure out which of the remaining wires under the dash go to the he heater and lighter plug and lights.

    Thanks! Best Regards, E.

  20. #79
    Super Moderator briano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond reputebriano1234 has a reputation beyond repute briano1234's Avatar
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    I reused the old gasket, but then again when I had mine apart for Crap in the drain, it was a tad newer, like a 81 in 85.....
    A good silicone bead would works as well, Black ULtra by permatex works really good and isn't as shiny as the BLACK.

    To reconnect the upper section to the Lower...my rubber band broke, so I used Foil back foam 3M duct tape. I love that stuff cept for peeling the paper off of it..Worked great, you don't see it, and it totally seals things.... While you have it all apart if your flappers have foam around them that is chunked out, you want to replace that as well. See my cold hands whistling Vent DIY.
    What do Divorces, Great Coffee and Cars all have in common?
    They all Start with good GROUNDS.
    Replace all of them that you can, 99 percent of flakiness will disappear.


    92, 93 Cabriolet.... 89, and 90 are Deceased.


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    Member BluGTI is a jewel in the rough BluGTI's Avatar
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    Re: Dash Dilema - Finish Installation of the Cabbie Dash in my Mk1 GTI?

    Hey Briano,

    Sounds good, I think silicone is the way to best assure I don't have a swamp on the floor after all my work on this! The question is - will I ever be able to get it apart again if I silicone it? Perhaps I wax the channel first?

    The foam is all long gone from the flappers so I will re-reread your whistling vents thread. Looks like the metal one in the heater box had strips along both sides of the long edge as well as on the bent over ends of the flap. I'll need to pick up whatever foam you used. I picked up a roll of foam insulation at the hardware store that looks like it will be perfect for the top seal of the heater back to the dashboard once I get all the rest of my parts.

    I'd seen your thread about the foil tape. My "rubber band" is still usable luckily.

    Rainy and cold here today so working on the dash bezel fixing the broken fastening points so it wont be rattling when I put the dash back together. Found part of a broken bezel in the junk yard and with the help of a dremel and a couple types of glue it should come out good as new. Will also be using some fiberglass to rebuild some missing dash bezel tabs and tabs to attach the dash clips by the windshield. But that stuff is much more in my wheel house than wiring diagrams!

    Have a great weekend!

    Thanks, E.

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